Decentralized social network Mastodon says it can’t comply with Mississippi’s age verification law — the same law that saw rival Bluesky pull out of the state — because it doesn’t have the means to do so.
The social non-profit explains that Mastodon doesn’t track its users, which makes it difficult to enforce such legislation. Nor does it want to use IP address-based blocks, as those would unfairly impact people who were traveling, it says.
nobody should comply
Huawei was forced to not comply and look what happened to their phones
We are neither as popular as huawei and neither chinese. We will be fine
OPPO is doing just fine and it’s Chinese with Huawei investment
There’s going to come a point at which the Feds/States will lean on the ISPs to handle the censorship for them. We’ve had people all over the Nat Sec system staring at the “Great Firewall of China” and asking themselves “Can we get something like this over here?”
This is why it’s perfect time to get some tech literacy regarding tor, i2p, yggdrasil, and shadowsocks. It’s not perfect solution to use tech to circumvent restrictions that shouldn’t be there in the first place, but sometimes it really comes to that point and it’s really nice to have all systems ready!
Arguably though, at some point they’ll just say “if we can’t read your traffic, you can’t use the Internet.”
Which still isn’t a problem, as I’m sure we can come up with a means to encrypt traffic to make it look entirely legitimate. But it’s going to take a while.
At that point people would probably go to a p2p adhoc wireless meshnet to bypass the ISPs entirely.
You mean “at which point, people will just say ‘oh, ok’”. (Assuming they even notice)
“People” will just comply. Tech savvy people like us are the only ones that could circumvent it
One… Not so disappointing fact is that means at least the Internet will go back to the pre-social media era.
You can feel it here on Lemmy still. It exists.
Except if the topic is wifi meshnets, no amount of tech savvyness will get you around an absence of other nodes nearby. General apathy is actually a huge problem here.
I used to think about this via mesh networks as simply routers, but now with nostr, IPFS, atProto and that new BT messaging stuff Jack Dorsey is on. Technically you could utilize your phone as an access point to the mesh network as you move around the city and load all the comms in the background. The latency would be high, but it could work. Also with 5g tech nowadays long range mesh networks are much more feasible albeit probably expensive for a hobbyist.
Sneakernets, my friend. Never underestimate the bandwidth of a pocket full of microsd cards traveling on the subway.
Flash drives of banned foreign films are the one method of accessing foreign media that north Koreans realistically have. It’s extremely hard to prevent people plugging a flash drive into their computer in their home to view some media
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Latency is horrific though.
That’s why I find systems designed for high latency by being “offline-first” interesting. Sync large quantities of information when you can, then consume offline. Like Usenet and email used to be. Most things don’t actually need to be “instant”.
Hi I have no idea what any of that means. Please let me join this class.
The situation does seem quite desperate. I’d like to heed your call. Please advise on most critical systems I should have ready right now today please. I know have a lot of work to do and must stay efficient
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If the internet were fully controlled, you’d need mesh networks - DIY, decentralized networks using radios, local connections, or other alternative infrastructures. I don’t know all the details, but Yggdrasil is a promising modern project that functions as an alternative “internet” for mesh networks, while also working over the regular internet.
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Within the normal internet, the most resilient solution against heavy censorship is probably Shadowsocks. It’s widely used in mainland China because it can bypass full-scale DPI (deep packet inspection) by making traffic look like normal HTTPS. There are ways for authorities to detect it, and there are counter-methods, but it remains one of the most reliable tools for evading state-level traffic filtering.
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Next in line are Tor and I2P. Both are very resilient, and blocking them completely is difficult. It’s a continuous cat-and-mouse game: governments block some bridges or entry nodes, but new ones appear, allowing users to reconnect.
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Finally, regular VPNs are useful but generally less resilient. They’re the first target for legal restrictions and DPI filtering because their traffic patterns are easier to detect.
Overall, for deep censorship resistance, it’s a hierarchy: mesh networks > Shadowsocks > Tor/I2P > standard VPNs. You can ask chatbots about any of these and usually get accurate, practical advice because the technical principles are public knowledge.
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I’m making a website to aggregate all of this information. Pro net neutrality, anti censorship laymens guide. Still in the works but its called zoracle.life.
I’ve tried a few times to check out i2p, it seems to take hours of leaving it running to even get to the point where you can very slowly and inconsistently load even the official pages though.
In my experience, if you have anything but “Network: OK” status (for example, “Network: Firewalled”), it’s not working properly. If you’re behind a VPN, you need to port-forward and properly configure a port in I2P config/settings. Another sign that it’s misconfigured is 0 participating tunnels. This is how properly configured I2P network statistics looks like with high internet bandwidth:
spoiler
All my IT and InfoSec friends have called me alarmist for suggesting even the possibility of a GFW of America, but every day that passes, it looks more and more likely to happen, doesn’t it?
Start practicing circumvention techniques now, y’all, while it’s still legal and cheap to do so. Learn amateur radio. Learn Meshtastic. Learn all the different censorship-resistant VPN technology out there. Host your own websites or services for friends, family, or your community. It doesn’t make it impossible, but it does make it hard, and fascism is nothing if not lazy.
I like you
Its already happening in Spain. Everyday there is a football match from the spanish league (thats from Friday to Monday, both included) LaLiga orders the ISPs to shutdown everything that uses Cloudflare under the pretext that the shady websites that offers pirated football use their services, killing easily 1/3 of the national traffic for like 4-6h.
Why the ISPs comply?
- The biggest ISP of the country (Movistar) also happens to be the main one that showcase legal football.
How is this legal?
- The judge that authorised this and the president of LaLiga have been friends since forever.
Eventually this will go the European court where they will rule this was illegal and anti-constitutional all along and give a Spain a fine (the the citizens have to pay), and revoke this bullshit, but untill then we are screwed. Nothing will happens to LaLiga, the judge, or Movistar, fucking privileged and corrupted bastards.
So, in other words, corruption.
Whoa whoa whoa! Callate chico!
You copied this from us Italians where we have the friend of Berlusconi providing the State with a censorship system (the Piracy Shield), allegedly exactly for the same reason since 2023.
Let’s give the right Fascists what is theirs.
I agree with mastodon, even though eventually Texas will enact similar legislation forcing me to use a vpn to read it
Woudn’t it be smarter to just leave the hellhole that is Texas? Either to the north or to the south, leaving is a win.
Sometimes there’s family or other things you just can’t take with you. Support structures you might not have somewhere else. Friends and neighbors. Mutual aid.
There can be circumstances that override that. But honestly, the more that flee. The easier it is to get what the fascists want. And at best you’re only helping yourself short term. Because no matter where you go. They will come for you if they can.
People fleeing fascism are just hoping other people will be forced to fight it and win before it gets to them. No matter what happens, eventually some people will have to stand and fight it. There is nothing wrong with deciding that the time to stand and fight it has come. It is scary, yes. It has been a long time since we have had to fight fascism. We might feel like we have forgotten how. But we will learn quickly. The same technology that enables them also enables us in ways just as profound, maybe more profound. Vive la resistance!
For real. I want me and my family to leave the United States. Bringing the entire family to a whole new life abroad is a very tall order.
And even there. There’s no guarantee. Going to Europe where fascists in Russia, Hungary, etc loom? Maybe you’ll be safe a little longer somewhere on the Asian continent with the currently slower rolling fascist forces there. But it’s only temporary. You can’t ultimately escape.
The question is. Where well the breaking point be for most people. What event will cause the public to drag these fuckers from their homes and hold them responsible. Because that’s what it’s going to take. For them to remember that they rely on us. Not only for their wealth. But continued existence. Only when that fear has been driven into them, will things even start to get better.
And it might surprise us. It may just be a red state that does it. One of these Republican sycophants getting dragged from a town hall. Assaulted by a whole community for their rolls in making things worse for everyone. Police are going to have a hard time locking up a whole town. And these elected ghouls that love to ignore their constituents will reel in terror. To be clear, violence isn’t the answer. Fear is. The fear of knowing we far outnumber them. That they could be subject to violent accountability at any moment. Dragged from their safe beds even.
Rather than encourage people to leave, we should encourage more enlightened people to move there, and change the political climate. A lot of states are closer to flipping than people think, and Texas is one of them.
Rather than encourage people to leave, we should encourage more enlightened people to move there, and change the political climate
You want to put those “more enlightened people” at risk of being Gestapo’d or killed? We need them where they can actually do a net positive effect!
First clean up the shit in Texas (or any other fascist shithole) and make it livable, then live there.
We need more federation and P2P in everything.
P2P! I have been screaming this into every forum at reddit since last piece of shit president was president. See? This is why!
What P2P solutions exist that need more attention? I know PeerTube does some neat P2P stuff to keep server load down (if they ever had the traffic…)
Keet, is a messaging app! It’s in beta right now, but its already pretty stable and has a ton of promise!!
More info= works kinda like torrents - your client’s IP & connectivity info is encrypted, then distributed across their ‘hyperDHT’. Users you’ve connected with can ping the DHT to get your current IP info, then you establish a direct connection to whoever you’re chatting! File shares are also accomplished over that DHT, so you can send files of any size, even terabytes!
veilid is a framework designed for hosting completely anonymous P2P apps. They already have a chat app reference implementation - (think P2P signal) and there are others popping up like vdrop
You can play multiplayer games with LAN support together for free using a program like Hamachi.
Use a free VPN (https://riseup.net/en/vpn) to download the game for free. I usually go for fitgirl repacks if they’re available. Then you and your buddies can connect to the same ‘server’ using Hamachi and play together.
I recommend doing this with the new Halo collection and Baldur’s Gate 3 so you can see it’s possible, even with new and advanced games.
Brains > wallets, don’t be a corporate simp.
Nostr solves the centralized hosting problem the current fediverse has. It’s still being developed, though, and is mostly used by crypto bros at the moment.
The thing is that works fine for the people pushing this kind of legislation. They hate how easy it is right now to spread inflammation and opinions, how quickly people can organize. This isolates their little fiefdoms and makes them easier to control.
The more interesting question is, who would you arrest? Just ignore the law. It’s unenforceable when it comes to the fediverse.
Those hosting the more popular environments. The posts would live on perhaps but target enough people and it likely becomes too small for them to care anymore, sadly.
All the more reason to host anonymously.
Push to decentralize, that is to push users from more popular instances to less popular ones, would be good then I guess.
Yeah, considering it is not impossible to geoblock per instance, they could.
Last time i checked “states rights” didn’t mean the right to impose your laws on people or businesses running out of other states.
If anyone from Mississippi wants to use our services I’m totally ready to ignore any and all laws that don’t acknowledge to sovereignty of the net.
Last I checked, “rights” now means “my right to control you”
That’s always what it meant to Republicans.
Also states don’t have one company to go after. It is nearly impossible to track down and file court orders for if your lucky non-profits in other countries.
Like I don’t think there are many people that host Mastodon instances that will listen to a court order out of the goodness of there heart.
So in this whole embarrassing dick measuring contest Eugen was wrong and Mike Masnick was right, then. Turns out “real decentralization” or not, Masto/Fedi’s structure doesn’t do anything to bypass this nonsense.
This is not new. People constanty claim AP and Fedi have benefits or features just for being decentralized that they absolutely do not have, but I have to admit I’m kinda shocked that Eugen will do that exact thing without any more self-awareness than the average Masto user. He should know better.
Well even if mastodon.social complies, there are many many other instances to choose from, from all different countries
and even other similar platforms like Sharkey or Mbin that work with Mastodon
It doesn’t matter, though. They all have the same choice to make: comply, shut down in that territory… or be fined an insane amount.
Eugen argued… well, pretty much what you are arguing now. The question Bluesky guy posed to him is what Mastodon.social would do and how would the presence of smaller instances prevent the issue, especially for instances without the resources to comply at all in the first place.
Eugen did not respond to that, but Mastodon.social just did, and the answer is… Mastodon.social will do the same thing as Bluesky and so will every other instance.
Because of course it’s pretty obvious that having a decentralized platform doesn’t help with stupid regulation, because stupid regulation applies to every instance. There’s no reason decentralization would bypass a blanket requirement unless the legal requirement has carved an exception for smaller platforms (and even then there’s a question of what counts as a platform in that scenario).
And the thing is… I’m okay with you not having though that through, but Eugen certainly must have. Right? I mean, they had a pretty well thought out answer for Techcrunch in 24 hours, they must have given it some thought. It’s an unforced communication error.
And who are they going to address that fine to? Tell them to shove it up their fucking arse as their laws mean nothing to you if you don’t live there.
Yeah, well, remind me not to do business with you under any circumstances.
Self hosting is cool and all, but if you think decentralized networks and services are a get out of jail free to bypass regulations applying to their centralized counterparts you shouldn’t be hosting decentralized networks and services.
For one thing if you have no understanding of legal compliance I don’t want you to store any of my data at all.
I don’t need to comply with American laws as I am not American. Their law literally does not apply to me
